Interview 10. On the first day as a boss, can you lie down again? feat. Annsley & Andy

Interview verbatim

Andy: We are all staying at home recently, because the epidemic has been raging recently, and today the government seems to have issued a three-level alert for the whole country, right?

Annsley: Can't go anywhere

Andy: Yeah

Annsley: It seems that there are more than three people...even parties can't participate

Awei: Okay, then we're almost done today

Annsley: Well then we'll...

Andy: No, it's five people

Awei: Then you hum

Andy: Clam? Huh~ what do you mean?

Awei: That ah, our outro

Andy: (barking)

Annsley: Did you forget? That's right (hums)

Everyone: (laughs)

Andy: Do you want to cut this part of him?

Awei: ok

Andy: Okay, okay, we all stay at home anyway, but because we are all freelancers, the difference is not that big when it comes to talking to us. The most difference may be the possibility... even going out to buy something will…

Annsley: like a fight

Andy: Yes, it is to keep vigilance like this, to protect you and me, yes, that's why we are going to discuss it today... Under the fever of the epidemic, how will it affect us freelancers? My own feeling, that Annsley himself is half freelancer and half part-time

Annsley: Part-time job, yeah

Andy: Well, let's share with different viewpoints, that is, for me, during this period of the epidemic, what kind of special feelings do you have for me, Awei, the representative of freelancer first...

Ah Wei: Why am I the representative of freelancer

Annsley: You're... you're an old bird

Andy: you're an old ass

Annsley: I am an egg

Awei: I am a teenage bird

Andy: You didn't see your feathers fell off

Everyone: (laughs)

Awei: Okay, no. I don’t think the epidemic actually broke out last year. Then I was more impressed by the May, last May, when the remote work in Taiwan was slowly... rising, and then a lot of The company will follow up, and then everyone can work from home, so this is also advocating a new type of work, that is, everyone works from home, whether you are a freelancer or not, then I think this year is the second time It's the peak, it makes me think...will this epidemic help this new type of work become more...popular?

Andy: Well, because I have seen reports before that... In fact, many companies want to do remote work, but because the cost is too high, the so-called cost is that they may have to increase the distance distance management

A Wei: Communication costs

Andy: Yes, yes, but because there is no epidemic, they don't want to spend too much money to experiment with this, so the outbreak gave them a chance, that is, they happened to be doing this, under the epidemic Enterprises can be forced to do this thing, and this thing also proves that it can work like this

Annsley: I think it's about cultivating... the trust between the employer and the person being cared for, because like our previous company was... We didn't take it seriously last May, we just went to work as usual I took the public transportation as usual, and then I went there for thirty or forty minutes, and then everyone didn't wear masks at work, but this year it became very serious, then I heard that this year is the one I will take the long distance next year. Work, then this is more in line with the need of our boss to believe that employees will work well at home, that is, the trust in both parties must be upgraded.

Andy: For Awei, it was the peak of the epidemic, or when it was not so severe, was there anything special about you that was different?

Awei: I think there should be no difference at all for freelancers. At most, the number of meetings with customers should be reduced, and then it will become an online meeting. The trust issue just mentioned by Annsley, I have always felt very Strangely, there are some jobs that can be done at home. In fact, it is because of this that I want to be a freelancer, but I don't quite understand why some jobs must be done in a company, not like...

Annsley: The service industry kind

Awei: Yes, yes, yes

Andy: uh uh uh

Annsley: I also think it's a matter of trust, that is, when you were talking about cooperation or hiring, you should have taken this aspect into account. Can you trust this person without managing this person? It will work for you, it is a bit like a freelancer. He is an employer and you are a cooperative relationship between us. I believe you will help me to complete this project, but the traditional employment relationship will be more biased to say... I Hire you, I will buy you

Awei: Just seeing it makes me feel at ease

Annsley: It's reassuring to see, and then you're going to use your time to redeem your body

Andy: A bit of an analogy

Everyone: (laughs)

Andy: So it means that the development is more and more towards personalization, right?

Awei: Yes, and I think this will have an effect, that is, if your work is not able to work remotely, you may be affected by it.

Annsley: Hmm

Awei: Then the relative cost will become the company's cost, because if you can't work because of this, then what's the point of hiring you? Maybe you can take unpaid leave, but at the next level, it will become , does that mean it doesn't matter whether you have or not?

Andy: hmmm

Awei: Yes, yes, this is an irreplaceable problem, but if you work from home today, then you can still put forward your output value, and then the boss also thinks it is ok, even more satisfied, I think this is the You can create your own personal value, and then there is an irreplaceable part of yourself, which is the advent of the era of personal branding

Andy: So it means that in this era, in addition to personal skills, it is necessary to break free from the constraints of time and space, and let the trend of higher elastic pressure to develop, right?

Awei: Yes, yes, it is mainly to sell technology

Annsley: But this premise is that you are a technical class, because some of them are like those in the service industry who pay attention to experience, and it does not mean that it is not bad without you.

Awei: Yes, yes, I just said something about technology, like if you work with a computer

Annsley: Yeah

Andy: OK, so for Annsley, it's still a part-time job, right?

Annsley: Hmm

Andy: You still have to go outside to do these jobs. What is the obvious feeling for the pair when the epidemic is at a relatively low peak?

Annsley: Actually, my company's side has also been reduced a lot (hours), and they are also an industry affected by the epidemic

Andy: hmmm

Annsley: Yes, so I will suddenly have a lot more time to be myself. Then I don't think it is said that I can play those games and software when I have time. Yes, in fact, my own affairs are less, but it is like a case. Also, I want to start working on my own plans as soon as possible, right?

Andy: Hmmmm, so for the type of work where you need to go to work in that location, it's simply being more idle

Annsley: Violence decreased

Andy: Less violence, OK, just like that bitcoin today... plunging, okay, okay, okay

Awei: I feel very deep

Andy: Yes, I feel very deep, I feel very deep, okay, so... we are under this epidemic now, so now it means that we have entered a very peak state, but I have seen it on the Internet, it is them That is to say... Assuming that after the epidemic is over, there are actually some types of work even if the epidemic is cured, that type of work will not be able to return, such as the remote work just mentioned, or the remote management method. Whether this thing will go back is still unknown, so do you think it means...even if you get off work...the first one is to say, what kind of changes do you think will be in the work style in the second half of the year, then it is good or bad. , what do you think may change in the type of work? What can’t go back? It’s just a personal point of view, because we still don’t know how it will change, right?

Awei: I think it's a little too confident to talk about predictions. I'll be more hopeful that it can become... You don't need to tie every employee to the company. You can really implement remote work completely. , then this can also further help your employees to train self-management and time management, and the point is that you can save the cost of that office yourself. Everyone has a meeting, I think this is the ideal state for me.

Andy: Then what do you think will change back, just because of the current epidemic... it is limited

Awei: I think change is always a matter of concept, it's the boss... Just like I said just now, people who have to see you will feel at ease, or they have to watch you sit there, even if you don't work.

Andy: hmmm

Awei: I have worked in some companies before, even if I have finished my work, the boss still thinks that you can sit there first, and it’s ok to sit in the shift. It’s similar to this concept, that is to buy you put it there

Andy: What about Annsley?

Annsley: Just like what A Wei said just now, it is to have more trust in employees, if it is to implement distance, I think there is a key to these, why is the boss... I see, why does the boss want to put the company Employees are tied to the company because sometimes they can't find people if they are far away. Otherwise, communication will not be smooth. Otherwise, face-to-face communication has many advantages. You can have hands and feet, you can draw, and you can compare , You can watch the same computer together. In fact, these are all technologies that can be overcome now, but there is no software or a thing that can be fully integrated to make this immersive experience better, so I think in fact, this thing will come out in the second half of the year, if This thing really came out, and the remote work thing can't go back to its original work style, right?

Andy: ok

Awei: He...he is predicting

Everyone: (laughs)

Annsley: I'm not predicting, I just think this thing is feasible, who's going to do it?

Andy: Well then we'll see Annsley's forecast in October

Awei: Verify, verify, now open for betting

Andy: yes yes yes yes

Awei: What's your own opinion?

Andy: I think traditionally people didn't dare to be far away. Now, because I have tried it, I may dare to be far away, yes.

Awei: I fell in love as soon as I tried it

Andy: Yes, because I think the boss will also evaluate it, because if the remote work style can reduce some unnecessary expenses or costs, then maybe the boss will be more willing, yes, if it is If the tool can really be properly developed during this period, then I think it is quite possible, yes, let's think about it, because some things can't go back, assuming the future is as everyone predicted, If the so-called remote work will always be there, then what kind of thinking do we need to cultivate in it?

Awei: I think it’s freelancer, freelancer’s thinking, and then add a little more English ability, that is, if you are no longer constrained by space and geography, then you take foreign cases in the same sense.

Annsley: Hmm

Awei: Yes, so I think this is something that should be quite expected. It is the feeling of transnational unhindered.

Andy: In addition to language ability, is there any other ability that you feel is absolutely necessary?

Awei: You should have a sense of responsibility. If you work by yourself, you will not manage yourself, time management or project management. This is a matter of responsibility. Ah, if you can't do these things, your boss can't trust you. If customers can't trust you, then no one will dare to cooperate with you.

Andy: hmmm

Awei: Yes, and then it's how you expose yourself

Andy: So there's nothing...I would like to ask one of them is Annsley and Awei, is there any kind of ceremony, or...Do you get up and go to work? Or will you have a sense of ceremony first, and then you can enter working status

A Wei: Let's have a cigarette (laughs)

Annsley: Now asking all day…

Awei: What is your schedule?

Annsley: yes yes yes

Andy: Yeah, it's you... how do you get yourself into a...because then maybe people will be working from home, or a lot of people are working from home now

Awei: Oh, I suggest you how to find the status

Andy: Yes, because in the past, people might have to go out to work, and it might be their ritual to take the MRT. Only after completing the MRT can I feel like working. Then I can’t take the MRT when I work from home today. Is there any kind of… your own way of getting yourself into work?

Annsley: I think it's better to separate the entertainment place from the work place. Maybe one place is dedicated to work, and then another place is where you can relax or do something.

Andy: Space

Annsley: Yes, the cutting of space

Andy: Okay, it might be a bit difficult for me to live in Siping before.

Everyone: (laughs)

Awei: You can cut four pieces

Andy: OK, I'm going to work today, so I'll take a step to the right...

Annsley: What do you do when you watch movies in bed, then work at your desk

Andy: Mmmm, the cutting of space

Awei: Yes, or standing on the same point, then what is standing and what is sitting?

Andy: OK, wow, it's okay to be so poor, what about Awei?

A Wei: I think I am more extreme, that is... I will divide this into two (parts) first, one is my work is what I want to do, and the other is that I just do work, ah, if I do it If something, I'm motivated to do it, I might just...like smoke a cigarette, and then adjust, I'll probably imagine what I'm going to do in a moment, and then frame it, because I want to do it myself That matter, so I will be very motivated. I probably have a good structure. After smoking, I can go to work directly, directly enter the working state, and don’t have to look for it at all, and then the second part is the work I don’t want to do, I take the work you don’t want to do as a responsibility. One way is to put the work you want to do behind the thing you don’t want to do, to attract yourself to finish the work you don’t want to do first. This is one way, and then the other way. One way is... to be clear about things and time, that is, sometimes you will be lazy when you do things, and you will feel like "I don't want to do things right now"

Annsley: Yes

Awei: You can do this, but the point is that you have to make sure that you are mastering the matter, not that it is chasing you. If this is the case, I sometimes feel like "Oh, I just want to lie down." Lie here all day", in this case, I will really lie down, I will give myself a promise, that is, when I get up, I just want to work, then I will lie down, and then lie down Lie, lie, lie... I'll get up and work when I'm almost lying down, but when I do it, I feel like it doesn't feel right, and what do I want to do, but I feel like I'm indulging myself, so I'll go back to the previous step, I'll just keep lying down until I don't want to lie down, and I'll lie down until I feel like it's annoying to lie down, and then I'll run to work

Andy: But usually it's night time (laughs)

Annsley: And what if you lie down, you lie down, and then you want to watch a movie? You go back to the previous step?

Awei: No, I just lie down. Do I want to lie down, or do I want to watch movies? If I don’t want to do it, the next step is to enter the working state, which is equivalent to the concept of getting the reward first, and I have to complete the concept of this cost, so this is a bit extreme.

Andy: Yes, and this sounds like self-control also needs to be strong, that is, you have to set your lying state, but usually people fall asleep when they lie down, how can there be any set state

Awei: Oh, that's true too. I sometimes want to sleep too, so I think you sleep until you don't want to. You should be in a state where you can't sleep until you can't sleep anymore. At that time, I think you will get up and work. , because I knew there was no way I could go back to sleep

Andy: But usually there's no way to go back to sleep and want to watch movies

Annsley: Yeah

Awei: No, but this is your own promise, "I can promise you now..." It's me talking to myself "I can promise you to go to bed now, but you have to do this after you sleep. , after the completion, we will discuss the next step, ah, if you think it is OK, then go to sleep.” Ah, if you think it is not OK, you have to think of other ways, which means that sleeping may not be what you really want.

Annsley: I want to tidy up, so here is Awei. If you want to sleep in the middle of your work, you go to bed first, and then you promise yourself that you must work when you sleep.

Awei: yes

Annsley: Then after you wake up, you have to work, but halfway through your work you want to watch a movie, and you go back to the previous step to sleep? Just keep sleeping?

Awei: No, this is a stage, you work to a stage, you need to rest is a... Another thing, it is just a rest, for example, I just remembered to take a walk, so it is not "I want to escape", but I feel that I should move, a concept of rest, not "I'm done, and then I'm going to reward myself for playing shit", do you understand the difference? One is dismissal, one is It's after school, you understand

Andy: What's the difference between after school and after school?

Awei: It's just take a break after class, it's nothing to do with you after school

Andy: Oh, I understand

Annsley: Got it, what about Andy?

Andy: My word is that I take a shower first thing in the morning

Awei: Huh? What happened to me before

Andy: Yeah, because I made myself clear, and in the morning I would if I could… I would make a list of things I had to do today, then I would make a list of things that bother me, and then I would make a list of some ... Anyway, the following are some things that are on my psychological side, and I will write them down first, because I think these things will interfere with your day, annoying things, that's really you... If you calm down carefully and think about it You will know which thing bothers you the most, you will... you will have to write it down, because I want to let my mental side have something to put out, write it down I may be free today and I will Go deal with it like this, then again I'll take a shower

Awei: Then it was almost night, ready to go to bed

Andy: Yes, yes, yes, it's like this for almost a day, there are too many annoying things in my mind, and then I hold it for too long

Awei: Then get up tomorrow morning to take a shower, then make another list, and then go back to sleep

Andy: That's right, so that wall in my room is that note paper, no kidding, that's... well, I'm... that's what I'm doing today, and I... love breakfast

Everyone: (laughs)

Awei: Why so suddenly?

Andy: So I'll... If I can have breakfast, I'll have breakfast first

Awei: Are you talking about the meal before twelve o'clock?

Andy: yes yes yes yes, the meal before twelve o'clock

Awei: Not the first meal to wake up

Andy: If I wake up for the first meal at noon, I will feel a little sorry for myself, that I am too late

Annsley: Didn't get breakfast

Andy: Yes, I don't have breakfast and I feel... I feel like the time is running out today, so I wish I could get up early. I'm practicing now.

Annsley: So if today is just annoying you all day, do you think it's the end of the world?

Andy: You're talking about annoying things?

Annsley: If there are two or three things that are very annoying today, two or three must occupy your whole day, and you have absolutely no way to do what you like.

Andy: Uh... well, then this thing I will feel divided... It's what I don't like but I should do, this thing is my priority to do, and then if I still have time, and then I need it too Do it, but I'll put it in the back, and if it comes back, it's something I might like to do or practice, and I'll put it like this at the end, then I think it's time to cut it, because I found a situation That is, when you have unlimited time for yourself to do, you will not use the time properly, that is, maybe you only need to do five things, and then you start to do the first thing, you keep doing, keep doing, keep doing, but you don't. Let yourself have a stop point at this time, you think you will come and stay there, maybe the priority is this... Today, the project is divided into ABCDE five parts to be completed, but if there is no time, you may You will really want to finish E. If you have time today, you may only be able to do A today. It doesn't matter, then you can do A, but when the time is up, you can do other things like this.

Awei: But it's easy for you to make half-finished things.

Andy: So we need a stage, we need a stage, that is, you have finished this stage and then you can finish it. Yes, then change to the next thing. If you want to sleep like Awei just now, or feel very annoying, I will change, I will change a thing, for example, I may exercise or play the guitar, because playing the guitar and exercising is what I want to do by myself, but it will not be boring, I may I'll cut it, just talk about the guitar, and do it like this, and let myself change my mood, but because you know...you watch Youtube and you're going to get stuck, so try to...you'll know which ones you get stuck in. Go in, which ones won't, then you have to avoid those things that will sink in, yes, this is still practiced

Annsley: Then I think these are more ideal things, because generally speaking, normal people rank things that you don't like, but you have to finish them today, and then the time There is no way for you to cut things like this...then the situation is that you will be surrounded by these annoying things all day long

Andy: I think I've experienced this thing recently, because Awei told me before that "you have to grab a time to finish things ahead of time", then I think this is what I'm thinking about. Do it ahead of time, the way to cut it into ABCD is a good way, because when you put it off to the last day, you will find the whole thing annoying

Annsley: Hmm

Awei: This one has graduated from kindergarten bird

Andy: yes yes yes yes i will do these things from now on

Awei: Yes, now you should be less likely to drag things to the end, but you are in control of your time

Andy: Right, right, right, right now, one thing is... I will grow back to a state of control, but I need to use some small skills to help you, because it is difficult to be hard, but if I use some small skills slowly, If you force yourself to adjust from the inside, like this...

Awei: Self-Management

Andy: Yes, yes, the effect will be better

Annsley: Oh, so I'm an egg, but the question is the state, stage of your ABCDEF, you will take this thing... if this thing is to be completed on the 30th

Andy: yes

Annsley: Then you will divide ABCDEF into 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27 to be completed, like this?

Awei: No, because you don't necessarily have the same unit for each unit, it's not equal, you just... For example, if you want to make a picture, and you want to make a website, how can the amount be the same

Annsley: Yeah

Awei: So he won't be equal, so if you use the sky to divide, the things in your picture will definitely be delayed... It's a waste of time.

Annsley: Yeah

Andy: Hmmmm, it's just like before... We've been working on something similar to a design recently, then I might think about what kinds of possibilities it might have today. Which characteristics, let me have a bottom in my heart, right or in which direction it may go to ABCDE, that is, I will start from big... try to practice from big to small, that is, start with the structure, then the second day to go to the next layer to make up

Annsley: Hmm

Andy: That's right, that's probably the case, because when the architecture comes out, you think about things inside the box, so you won't get messed up. That's how I do it myself.

Annsley: Then it's better to be in control

Awei: I think I can add a point about this... When you plan your time or promise someone else's things, you must first be able to determine how long it will take. If... For example, we are going to do a project now Okay, then you're going to design something like me now, it just might take time, unless you're doing it from a template, that's fine, but if you're really going to design, you're going to search for something, or say you To do some functions, then he must have research elements in it, you can't estimate the time, this kind of thing should be reduced, and then its time will be the most, even if it may be done at once, but you don't With high certainty, you need to save more time. If it is like typing a document or something, you can be sure of the time. When you are preparing to promise others, your time It should have been planned, so when you say "OK, I can complete" this promise, usually the next sentence will be followed by "When will I give you", then your time Basically, it is planned, and then there is no way to predict things. You can only say "I may take some time to study this thing, and I will reply to you if I can estimate the time after researching". Your time won't be so... the uncertainty factor is so high

Annsley: Understand

Andy: Well, this thing can also be applied to projects, because I was writing projects in the past, so there are two things that I think are quite important to better control the time. The first one is the structure I just talked about, then If it comes again, it is the keywords or key content in it, that is... For example, I am going to write a market analysis today. In the first stage, I will first post all the news reports, and the links I will use may be posted. I may write two key points below the first link. I may first use hashtag to mark which two points I want to write, then which point I want to write in the second one, and the third one. At some point, like this, the structure and core have come out, then you can probably...you can control it, you don't have to go into words and say how I want to write better, but because your direction comes out, you will be able to. It's better to write, yes, so like me and Awei, uh... freelancer or when doing this thing, I think mastering the key is also a very important ability

Awei: Organize it

Andy: Yes, organize, organize, yes, um... Then we talked about freelancer before we knew it and then we forgot about the epidemic, but...

A Wei: The epidemic is over

Everyone: (laughs)

Andy: Yes, the epidemic is to let us know what we will face if we become an independent worker, so working from home or working outside is that we need to find a way to get into work. , that space and time may also be cut to carry out, there is also the ability of self-management and the ability to seize time, yes, okay, then today's discussion and sharing are here, then I hope this epidemic can be over soon, Then everyone becomes freelancer, YO

Awei: Everyone is flooded when we talk together, ok

Andy: OK, OK, that's the end of this episode, bye bye

Awei, Annsley: goodbye

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