Interview 07. Stand up now, will life just turn off the lights? feat. Annsley & Andy ((Buy me a pack of cigarettes before leaving get off work)

Interview verbatim

Awei: Hello?

Annsley: Hello?

Awei: Are you off work?

Annsley: Don't call me, I'm still working overtime

Awei: We are going to record a podcast today

Annsley: There's no way, I'm still in the company, and everyone doesn't get off work

Andy: Hello everyone, I'm Andy, today's host, yes, we're discussing overtime today

Awei: This new opening, I don't know if you like it or not

Annsley: I was kind of startled and suddenly jumped out of my side

Andy: It doesn't matter, stabilize the morale of the military, stabilize the morale of the military, we are discussing overtime today, like the situation just now, what time is Annsley now? She is still working overtime at 10:30, yes, well, then we will come first today Come up with a topic and situation, that is, it is the time for you to get off work at six o'clock today, but when you have finished everything, but the people around you are still working in their seats, what will you choose at this time?

Annsley: As you can see, I'll stay there

Andy: Just wait until they leave before you go

Annsley: Yeah yeah yeah

Andy: Okay, what about Avile?

Awei: I'm just leaving

Andy: You go straight? Don't care about anything?

A Wei: Don't care about anything... They do what they like, what do they do for me? I just leave, it's done

Andy: OK, a very free and easy person, well, let's go back to Annsley, why do you have such thoughts, you...the reason why you dare not go is what are you thinking?

Annsley: Actually, I am a person who is not very resistant to the system, so when the corporate culture is like today, I may actually find other ways to make this time valuable.

Andy: Um, for example?

Annsley: For example, I may make my work more detailed, or I will see what resources the company has to learn

Andy: Okay, let me go back and define first, there is no overtime pay for this overtime.

Annsley: That's right...

Andy: So you're still staying?

Awei: Accountability

Annsley: Accountable

Andy: Okay, so it's like...can you give a more specific example? What kind of...things would you be looking for to make overtime valuable to yourself

Annsley: Actually... If your job is not part-time, part-time, etc., you can actually learn a lot in the company. For example, you can study a few more e-commerce platforms, or you can go to more Research is a marketing tool, and you are still absorbing information during these times...

Andy: Well, then, Awei, if you want to refute at any time, you can refute it. You look like...you really want to...

Annsley: How?

Awei: No, I think these things are things that you can do when you are working, then if you do it during overtime, and then convince yourself that I am not working now, I will do it now In terms of optimization, I think it's a little self-comforting (laughs)

Andy: Then ask yourself, are you happy when you are working overtime to do these things? Or... "Damn, why am I doing these things" like this

Annsley: Because everyone stayed, so I couldn't help it, and then I just felt... I wanted to leave.

Awei: Right, so you want to leave, so you think everything you do at that time will be worthless, that's just your way of persuading yourself

Annsley: It 's a way to convince yourself

Andy: So what were you two pulling at back then? What was your point of going? What was the point of not following?

Annsley: The point I want to go is...I have other things to do at night, but the point where I can't go is...that's a corporate culture, and if you do that bulge in the middle, you become a The target, then there may be some attacks or some public opinion that you can't control.

Andy: Well, how do you deal with human pressure, Awei?

Awei: I think the culture of this company is not very healthy. It just makes you feel that you must be the same as everyone else. If you are different, you will become a very strange person. Do I stay here, or do I want my value? I'll take that into consideration

Andy: So you put value, or practical work, over favor, right?

Awei: Yes, because I think... For me, I think value is still more important at this stage. If you buy me not to buy my value, I don't know what I want in this company. Why, unless you can make me gain, then... unless you are in a state where you can make me gain, but then I might leave all of a sudden

Annsley: What was the harvest like?

Awei: For example... I think that at the current stage of my study, I will pay more attention to the gains from my studies. If I don't know something about him, then I will want to learn. I think it is a gain, and the other part, I think if there are no variables, I would want to get off work on time

Andy: I believe that commuting to work on time in society must be... that is, with the development of this kind of media in recent years, this trend is actually more and more popular, but I think there are still some people who will Because other people didn't get off work, even you already know that other people are waiting for others to get off work, so you are in a state of terrifying balance and dare not get off work, so what's wrong with yourself is because you just got up and went straight to work, and Did this case of public opinion happen later?

Annsley: Usually it's because of fear, fear of this happening, so people don't do it

Andy: So it's your own mind that's at work?

Annsley: Yes, maybe it will stay for a while, and then everyone will say "Huh? Do you want to get off work?", and then almost, everyone will go together like this

Andy: Okay, so everyone is facing the moment when they get off work at six o'clock, and then if you don't leave this situation, there will be a lot of tension and contradiction. Well, if we spread it out, what do you think are the factors? It is a factor that can be provided and evaluated in the heart of the person facing this situation

Annsley: I think it should be about your network and your impression of others. It is your work performance, but your work performance does not mean your own work ability, but the way others see you.

Andy: But I think it's necessary to define what it means to say... Well, you get off work on time at 6 o'clock today. Do people really gossip about you? The second is it really affects you. performance appraisal or what? Work ability? Is this thing verified?

Annsley: This may not have happened

Andy: So...? Scared?

Annsley: But just be afraid of it

Awei: Maybe that group of people are afraid

Annsley: Everyone has a horrible balance over there

Awei: Yes, then the boss thought in the office, "Why don't those people get off work?" Then outside he wanted to say, "It's over, it's over, everyone won't leave."

Andy: No, the boss wants to say, "When will these people leave? I'm the boss, how can I leave before them?"

Everyone: (laughs)

Awei: Then everyone don't leave

Annsley: Horror Triangle Balance

Andy: And then the people down there want to say, "How can I leave before the boss is gone?"

Awei: Don't get off work for everyone

Andy: OK, I think some companies should have such a balance of terror, so is it possible that fear comes from ignorance?

Awei: That's it

Annsley: I think another point is that you have an unconfident feeling about your own incompetence, that is, you want to get off work, and then you dare not do it, you are afraid that you will become the target of public criticism, and then go to other places. Is there no way to survive? Is that what it means?

Andy: But what is the relationship between incompetence and off-duty? Are you afraid of... or are you afraid of public opinion?

Annsley: I think this fear has a lot of back effects, that is, you may be afraid that people will give bad comments to you, which will affect your performance appraisal, and then you may need to find a job again, and then when you are looking for a job, If your ability is insufficient, it will become... You are very attached to this place, so you must attach to the cultural feeling here.

Andy: Okay, Awei, I think you need to refute

Awei: This is to scare yourself, the experts, to scare yourself

Annsley: Expert in Self-Terrorism

Awei: Yes, in this case, in this company... what is your value? You feel that you are incompetent, and you feel that you want to rely on everyone's good impression. What is the value of this person? I think This is still something to consider.

Annsley: Because I think a lot of people will have this idea, that is, they may only be thinking about getting off work at the moment, but many steps in the subsequent consideration are to consider that point, and then return to the original problem of not being able to get off work.

Andy: Well, presumably the usual one... This should be a bit scary in your company... Either it's a scary company, or you really think too much, don't you?

Awei: I think it's more like a big company versus a small company. Big companies should have this kind of status...

Annsley: It should be, yeah

A Wei: What is the old bird and the new bird in particular?

Annsley: Oh, there are many classes

Awei: Yes, if you are a start-up company, everyone is basically not too different.

Andy: Well, if it's a big company, then everyone really doesn't dare to leave work, then you...you just leave? Or?

Annsley: Will you make any changes?

Awei: Actually, I have worked in large and small companies, and I just leave (laughs)

Andy: Oh, well, I think this is a good thing, because this is to verify whether it will really happen like what Annsley just (reported), then you are a big company, you go directly, do others say what you say?

Awei: Uh... In fact, companies big and small have been reacted, it should not be said that they have reacted... Even supervisors and colleagues will ask me about this one thing, "Huh? Why did you leave so early?"

Andy: Hmm, so what do you say?

Annsley: Colleagues also ask you?

A Wei: My colleagues are more frequent, and my colleagues ask more often, because I sometimes ask my colleagues to get off work together, and then they think, "It's just now, you're going to get off work?", I'll say, "Ah, no time. What are you doing after work?"

Annsley: It 's time to get off work.

Awei: Yes, then he will say "If you are like this, will people think that you are like this, and people will think that you are...whatever, so, so", but I felt like saying "ah, I'm done, I'm done. Otherwise, what do you want me to do? Sitting over there?"

Andy: So it's "I'm done with it", this thing allows you to just walk away?

Awei: Yes, and I think I can speak so full and confident, mainly because I go to work on time, that is, I won't delay a minute, but I don't want to be occupied by the company. , I think this is mutual... Mutual responsibility? I am responsible for the company when I go to work on time, and I am responsible for myself when I leave work on time, so sorting out the two factors you just mentioned, one is that you are afraid of others talking, right? then a little scared

Annsley: I'm just afraid of the follow-up, a series of effects

Andy: A series of effects, is to think "Wow, I may be behind... do it, as soon as I stand up, I will be behind in my life... work..."

Annsley: It just broke (laughs)

A Wei: As soon as I stand up, my life turns off the lights

Andy: To turn off the lights, Ah Wei means I'll just leave when I'm done

Awei : Yes, my question is Annsley, are you very concerned about whether you go to work on time?

Annsley: Yes, work is a must

Awei: I'm not referring to the deduction of money, or what, even if there is no deduction today, today is a flexible commute to work, and then we set it at nine o'clock, so will you be there on time at nine o'clock? Or Will you be early, or will you be late?

Annsley: Well... I said my situation is good, that is, we are flexible, there is a flexible half-hour work time, then some of us may leave work at 6 o'clock in the afternoon, but if you come at 9:30, you will I get off work at 6:30, which should be the case in many companies. Yes, many colleagues responded to me. At the beginning, they went to work on time at 9:00, and at the end, they might be invited to a meeting at 6:00 or work overtime. Well, why don't you come back at 9:30, it's not too late

Awei: So that is the normal time to be occupied, so I thought, "Why should I arrive early?"

Annsley: Yes, it's the phenomenon, but if it's about being on time, it's a must, because we're clocked

A Wei: If you go to work at nine o'clock today, and you are invited to a meeting at six o'clock on time, how would you react?

Andy: Invitation (laughs)

Awei: You will go to the drive obediently, will it be open until eight o'clock?

Annsley: I think I will still drive, because there is no way, but I will say that there is still a little thing tonight, maybe there is no way to drive for so long, is this my last resistance? (laughs)

Awei: But if this thing happens in a normal way, you can't have things every night, right? That's what the other party thinks.

Annsley: Well, but the other party won't come to me for a meeting at 6:00 pm so often. If it does happen, there is no other way. It can only have a meeting, but I think this is a very bad culture.

Ah Wei: Andy Le? If it is you who will adjust your working hours or will you not have meetings or what?

Annsley: Yeah, aren't you going to the meeting?

Andy: I will evaluate, I will evaluate

Annsley: What is the point of assessment?

Andy: It's... well, you give me 1 to 5 today and 6 o'clock every day, then you are trying to trouble me

Everyone: (laughs)

Annsley: So are you going to talk to him?

Andy: No, then I said, can it be five o'clock, why must six o'clock? Is it really that important? Are Americans just getting up at six o'clock? bluff me

Everyone: (laughs)

Andy: Yes, so I think there must be a valid reason, otherwise what is the commute time at 9 am and 6 pm? There is a reason for it, then you need to finish it during working hours.

A Wei: Then if he gives you a status that is us... For example, the time when the business comes back is 5:30, but this is the time when the business talks with the customer. He deliberately gives you a status that cannot be changed, so it will not be possible to talk tomorrow morning. ?

Annsley: Maybe he'll be replying to the client at night

Andy: Okay, I think I think this situation, I first... I have to evaluate, that is, if you are like this every day, then we either pay overtime, or I work a little bit later, because This involves a lot of legitimacy, that is, the Labor Standards Law stipulates eight hours, but you are coming back from your business at 5:30 today, but what about me? So why are you doing this to the employees? Is it bad? So Is this thing needed... or should we go back to the question of legitimacy?

Annsley: So Andy would choose to go to the boss theory...communication

Andy: I won't talk about the theory, but I don't want to slap the table and choke the boss, but I think the legitimacy is basic, but I think back to the element just now, what are the elements that pull you to and from work? , In fact, I thought about it a little before recording the Podcast. What factors will I evaluate? The first one is to assume that I have to work overtime. Is there money? This is a realistic consideration, and this is the first point I evaluate. , the second point is whether this matter will really affect my network, I may go, other people will gossip here, but they can gossip, but then Is there any difference for me, so the second thing is interpersonal relationships and connections, but not from fear, and the third thing is whether my overtime work can improve my ability, and I am now Is the thing I am doing to improve? The fourth is the mission and dream, that is, I want to complete this project, or is it related to what I want to accomplish? Take these things and these factors into consideration, whether I want to go or not, I won't be so reckless and say "Oh, if I want to go, I don't care about the three-seven-twenty-one, I'll just let him go", but When everyone is working overtime and working together for a very urgent matter, wouldn't I become a cancer? Then I chose to stay because everyone watched the boss not get off work and didn't get off work, then I felt this Things are very meaningless, so back before the recording just started, Awei talked to me about the opportunity cost issue, that is, what should I consider to decide whether I want to leave or not?

Annsley: We can define that working overtime is actually not very good, but if you have to work overtime if you have to intercede, should you resist? Or should you obey? You have to consider these things in the middle, and finally make your decision

Andy: Alright, so what I'm preaching here is to…

A Wei: Propaganda? (laughs)

Annsley: Don't use propaganda (laughs)

Andy: Okay, so I'm going to appeal here, isn't it better? (laughs), so I think here I think everyone still has to make an objective assessment when facing this problem and say "why" It is "Why are you leaving? Why are you not leaving?" Yes, then I think everyone should tell you how you feel today.

Awei: It's just that everyone gives some advice.

Andy: Yeah

Awei: Because in fact, I think I still disagree (laughs), I think you are using your own time when you work overtime, so it is not your working time, unless you are in the company to be completely yourself things, then I think it's OK, but if I'm in the company today, I'm forced to stay there, I have to, and then I have to convince myself "what can I possibly do", I think that's super It's worthless, I don't want you to give me money, so I think it's still a self-responsibility, yes, so I don't support overtime at all, and I don't support it for any reason.

Andy: OK

Awei: Then my colleagues and those I will choke him

Annsley: Are you really going to cut this part in?

Awei: Yes, because I have a colleague on my side and I choked on it

Andy: I was his colleague before...

Awei: (laughs)

Annsley: It turns out that there is such a coincidence. Well, I don’t think it’s necessary to be so harsh and extreme like A Wei. I think there are two things. One thing is whether you have the ability to resist. I refer to these connections. To influence you, and then to go is to influence your decision, whether you have the ability to lose all of this, so when you are just deciding whether to go... Maybe it's theory or endure, you think like Andy said about money, When evaluating your connections, abilities, and missions, you still return to your own abilities in the end. If you are as powerful as Awei, maybe...

Awei: No... no no no no no

Andy: What is the Mutual Support Conference now? (laughs)

Annsley: Mutual support conference (laughs), maybe...you can just go straight like he did, and then have your own opinions and your own principles

Awei: I don’t think this has anything to do with actual strength. This is the principle. You have to let people think that you are a principled person. You have principles for yourself, and you also have principles for others. Only then will everyone respect you.

Annsley: Yes, but it still has to be assessed, because some people may have a livelihood...(problem), and can't do this

Awei: Oh, alright

Annsley: Yeah, I don't think so... if you're like this, everyone's leaving tomorrow, everyone's being fired

Andy: But I want to make a point that... it needs to be verified whether the shadow affects your livelihood. If you really stand up today, you will... your livelihood will be over, then I think it really needs to be objective... just Really need to assess whether you want to stand up

Annsley: Yeah (laughs)

Andy: So...but going back to most of the assumptions I just talked about, if you think you stand up and your livelihood is over, if you think it's fear, so you need to verify this thing

Awei: Just observe

Annsley: Maybe you need to observe it, on the other hand, it is also to improve your ability, so that this fear will disappear.

Andy: OK, but my way is to face this matter directly, because I think it will take a long time to guess with other things, yes, so I think no matter what method is used to verify whether it will be practical or not It happens, but you need to figure out every point of your consideration, and then give yourself a why (why), and then make a decision. It's good, so are the viewers who are listening to this podcast currently working overtime? Consider what you want don't stand up

Awei: So vulgar, stand up

Everyone: (laughs)

Annsley: I feel good, stand up

Awei: stand up

Andy: Okay, that's it (laughs)

Original link Independent sample creation process